Father Verses Son is a stunningly illustrated poetic correspondence about life, death and the human comedy - and about men bumbling towards love. Selected for Scribner’s Best American Poetry, this new book began when a 99-year-old Beat-era novelist is reactivated into writing again by his sons, who send him poems by US Mail. One of those sons, Ari Gold, is a member here at PSNY & sat down for an interview with How to Poet.
What’s the earliest memory you have with your Father?
I was about three years old, around the time of my parents’ divorce. I was climbing a piano so that I could see out the window of the house - I had to say goodbye to my dad who was walking away down on the street. As I climbed, the piano became very steep and just at the moment I was about to be able to wave to him I was sliced up by rotating knives. My first memory is a bad dream! Fortunately, my waking memories are much more pleasant and loving: singing the sound of seagulls and foghorns in the steam room at the Press Club. This latter memory appears in my poem “Forever Christmas Light on Sexy Broadway.” The divorce is there too, in different poems.
How was poetry spoken about in your home?
I grew up with my mom and would visit my dad in the afternoon and sometimes we would write short stories on his typewriter together. He didn’t really talk about poetry until much later, as an adult, as we edged towards the need for brevity in our communication and he was in his final years. He had wanted to be a poet when he was a young man, but publicly backed away from it by the time he got through college. It was great to be a part of him getting back into it in his 90s. The myth of people calcifying at a certain age is just that, a myth.
Why did you turn to poetry, and not a film, to chronicle this history?
Actually I did both: we made this book of poetry correspondence, called Father Verses Sons (FatherVerses.com) and then also filmed a fully improvised movie where we “play ourselves”: Brother Verses Brother (BrotherVerses.com). The movie focuses more on my musical relationship with my brother, but my father also acted in it, a few weeks before he died. Francis Ford Coppola has recognized this tiny little film, and joined the team as executive producer, which will be helpful in getting the film out into the world. We improvised the film in the streets, with the first scene being right in front of City Lights Books, where we launched the book.
What was the biggest peak in constructing this collection, what was the deepest valley?
When I was mailing my father poems by US mail - poems I had been writing with my online poetry group during the pandemic - it was lovely to get piles of new poems back from my dad, and to know that we could inspire each other. We were able to share truths about his confronting aging and death, and I saw his humor and zest for life, and I was able to be sure that he really read what I sent him, which wasn’t always true about our communication when I tried to talk with him on the phone the correspondence sustained us both during lockdown.
The biggest valley by far was that just as I finished the many months of layout (it’s a book of poems and photographs, so the layout was fun but laborious), my collaborators - my father and brother - both became suddenly and seriously ill. My dad was in SF, my brother in LA, and my father died. My brother was in the hospital with a mysterious illness for about two months, and survived, but after these months I was wrecked emotionally. The book was being printed while all this went down, and I had to perform the book launch at City Lights without either of them, which was very challenging emotionally. My brother is back to good health now, which I am so grateful for.
What about the Beat poets do you think us modern poets should keep at the forefront of our practice?
Starting in college, my dad was good friends with Allen Ginsberg, and not a fan of Kerouac at all - I think he had mixed feelings about the whole designation of the Beats. I personally like the fact that the Beats democratized poetry and made it cool - I think this kind of revival is necessary now. I’m not sure it’s quite happening with the Instagram / TikTok poetry trend. It’s good to know that people at least like the idea of poems, but I do think some discipline in the use of language is necessary and missing in some “popular” poetry these days. But yes: bring it to the streets, read your poems out loud, perform with music! I’ve done this on stage with different bands, with Glen Hansard and with others. The Beats, for all their flaws, remembered that poetry is music.
After reading this book, do you have a reading list you can suggest to our readers, to explore this era and what these figures can teach us personally?
“The Man Who Was Not With It,” by my dad Herbert Gold, and “Still Alive, A Temporary Condition” (also called “Not Dead Yet”) are great visions of the Beat-adjacent world that I think are worth reading.
Could you leave us with a favorite excerpt/poem from the book & why?
I’ll give you a poetry-pair - short ones to give the vibe of a father and son talking about love and death:
Diagnosis & Verdict
(by Herb)
Even well into my eighties
I thought I was a young man.
I knew I would die someday
But the diagnosis would have to be
He died of the complications of young age.
It’s Death!
(by Ari)
Fire alarm!
Emergency!
It’s Death!
Death is coming!
It’s around the corner!
Or maybe it crashed into a ditch!
It got lost on the way back from the game!
It’s been sidearmed by a jackknifed truck and fell into a hole!
It’s taken a detour because of Mama Wilbur’s amazing cupcakes off Exit B!
It’s having a nap down by that pond where Judy DiAngelo lost her bra (and maybe more)!
It’s chasing a dog who’s chasing his tail who’s chasing the dog around the garbage pail!
Come visit, Death, don’t be scared!
You belong here, you know.
And though none of us want you to come,
we really really couldn’t live without you.
We’re so thankful to Ari for sharing the behind-the-scenes to creating this poignant collection. It’s the perfect gift for Father’s Day - grab your copy at the link below!
“A wise & loving book that tells me more about men than ten years of marriage.” —Natasha Leggero
“Outsmarts sadness & death.” —Jerome Charyn, Ordre des Arts et des Lettres
Written by F.M Papaz featuring Ari Gold
F.M Papaz is Greek-Australian poet, editor and teacher who believes that there is space at the literary table for everyone and is excitedly setting up your cutlery. Her poems have appeared in Wild Roof Journal, Five South and Mantissa Poetry Review. She is the Managing Editor of Milk Press and a 2024-2025 Barbara Germack Foundry Fellow. Connect @fmpapaz on socials or fmpapaz.com/ings to find her monthly newsletter about living a creative life.
Ari Gold is a director, poet, musician, and founder of Grack Films. His third feature, Brother Verses Brother—a one-shot musical executive produced by Francis Ford Coppola—premiered to rave reviews at SXSW alongside his debut poetry collection, Father Verses Sons, which was written as a “correspondence in poems” by US mail alongside his dying Beatnik-era father Herbert Gold. A Student Oscar winner who’s premiered films at Sundance, Telluride, and Karlovy Vary, Ari’s work blends emotional depth and formal innovation. His next film, Helicopter, is now in post and features Alejandro Jodorowsky. His eclectic career includes the cult comedy Adventures of Power, the romantic drama The Song of Sway Lake, a drumming podcast called HotSticks, and a Guinness World Record for leading the largest air-drum ensemble on Earth. He is on instagram @arigold.